Active members of the Health, Freedom and Peace Movement will ask Charles to address the crisis in Gaza and the integrity of Kennedy's stance on peace.
Hi there! I'd love to hear about how the Eisenstein speech went and what was conveyed regarding the genocide in Gaza. Its the main issue preventing me from getting on board and voting for RFK and I know there are so many in the same position. As such, your post got my attention and any follow would be greatly appreciated.
Zeya, I will write something this week about it. Who are you planning on voting for right now? I am working on this issue as part of the campaign, rather than from outside it.
To answer your question, I imagine if I don't cast my vote for RFK I will almost certainly abstain. Despite coming out of the left (What little worthwhile aspect of it we have in this country) there is no reality in which I would ever support Biden and his handlers. The only question would be whether my rage and revulsion towards them would be enough to blackpill me into casting a vote for Trump. It's tempting, but even under those circumstances I don't think I could support a charlatan and self-serving grifter who probably answers to many of the same masters anyhow.
98% of rfks platform and message is deeply resonant with me and an embodiment of so much of what I think we need to get out of the many traps we are ensnared in, from the military industrial complex to the the burgeoning censorship industrial complex to his understanding of the profound effect of currency, debasement and the glimmer of hope that is Bitcoin, and so on and so forth. The problem in my view is that all of the merit of that is based on him truly being an independent actor that is not controlled by any of the interests that clearly pull Biden's strings and likely many of Trump's as well. I found his treatment of the genocide in Gaza as a guest on the Hill in the fall And in a few other venues to be a frankly appalling departure from his extremely measured intelligence and reason when speaking about Ukraine or any other disgusting American intervention. The contrast was sharp enough as to give me real pause and wonder what his relationship is to AIPAC and other deep pocketed interests thoroughly aligned with Israel. In my view, if he's not independent from those interests, he's not the independent candidate I want him to be. If he's so beholden to someone that he can't speak out against a literal genocide then I don't know how to value his noble and quite beautiful rejection of other American military fascinations. I did listen to his recent podcast episode intended to facilitate peacemaking dialogue between a Palestinian and a Israeli scholar hoping to find some clarity on this question, But while I did find his own description of his journey towards forgiveness of Sirhan Sirhan quite moving and powerful. I still found a disturbing bent towards the idea of Israel as a shining light in the darkness and a sort of default stance towards The Palestinians as the aggressors who need in some way to be brought to heel. I find nothing in my analysis of the last 75 years or of the current ghastly state of affairs to suggest that this is the case and I'm simply too confident of RFK's deep intellect to think that he would believe that he would entertain such a simplistic analysis. Leaving me to wonder what the genesis is of a viewpoint that seems so contradictory from the rest of his platform.
I'm still hopeful that I'll be able to find clarity on this and that it will resolve things sufficiently that I can get behind rfk's candidacy completely.
I think what I would like to know, at a basic level, is has the RFK campaign taken donations or other types of support at any point from AIPAC or other Israeli lobby groups.
I listened to the second installment of "A Path to Peace" and found it extremely disappointing and disheartening. In what is supposed to be a dialogue about how to reach peace between Israel and Palestine RFK chose a very hawkish zionist ex-mossad officer, which is fine. But to represent the Palestinian voice he chose a British-Palestinian moderate who clearly didn't even understand the issues very well whose entire analysis was that Palestinians should just give Israeli's whatever they want and that Palestinians don't have nearly any good reason to even be aggrieved. This essentially created a dynamic in which RFK hosted a debate about how to create peace between Isreal and Palestine with two pro-Israel voices who just agreed on everything and who and gave the actual Palestinian side of things no voice at all. This was somewhat similar to what I experienced in listening to the first episode, but much worse.
I know you didn't ask me for my opinion on this, but i certainly would be curious to hear yours. And i'd still like very much to hear what Eisenstein had to say.
I am preparing to discuss the elephant in the room. There are other important stories that Gaza provides a distraction from which I reported in my latest post. That said, I did not see these Path to Peace episodes and wonder if you could please provide links in the comments here, and many thanks for posting. You are always welcome. Leland
What I was referring to was two episodes of the RFK podcast produced as part of a series 'The Path to Peace'. The first part aired in March and featured a dialogue between two Israeli and Palestinian scholars and facilitated by RFK. The scholars in question were actually friends and the tenor of the episode was very civil and thoughtful. I found RFK's description of his own path to forgiveness with Sirhan Sirhan in the intro incredibly moving. That said, the usefulness of the conversation seemed very limited by RFK's clear bias towards Israel and that the Palestinian scholar in the episode was clearly on the extremely moderate and pro-concessions side of the spectrum to an extent that there was very little conversation either about the horrors of what's happening in Gaza and even in the West Bank or about any real legitimacy to the Palestinian experience of being extremely aggrieved and persecuted. You can find it anywhere where his podcast airs but theres a link here:
While I was just moderately discouraged by the first installment the one that just aired went much further down a road that left an awful taste in my mouth. I had hoped that the amount of devastation that has unfolded since March would have moved RFK in a direction of greater sympathy for the Palestinian plight and that this new episode would reflect that. Instead, it was essentially a conversation between a hard line zionist propagandist and a British-Palestinian writer who seemed only unsuitable for the project by virtue of being inarticulate and not seemingly a very deep thinker, but also someone totally divorced from the Palestinian experience by virtue of being a diaspora Palestinian with very little analysis or sympathy himself for the Palestinian desire for freedom, sovereignty, or even just not being butchered. I have to confess I was not able to finish the episode as it felt like an entirely unproductive Pro-Israel echo chamber.
As I have expressed, I have such a strange sense of cognitive dissonance between my perception of RFK as being morally courageous, deeply humane, and impressively intelligent on just about every topic...and then my perception of him as being none of those things in relation to what certainly feels like one of the most important topics of our time given the ongoing genocide.
So, yes, I would be extremely glad for RFK or any campaign spokespeople etc addressing this elephant the in room in any capacity they can.
Hi there! I'd love to hear about how the Eisenstein speech went and what was conveyed regarding the genocide in Gaza. Its the main issue preventing me from getting on board and voting for RFK and I know there are so many in the same position. As such, your post got my attention and any follow would be greatly appreciated.
Zeya, I will write something this week about it. Who are you planning on voting for right now? I am working on this issue as part of the campaign, rather than from outside it.
Hi Leland. I would certainly appreciate that.
To answer your question, I imagine if I don't cast my vote for RFK I will almost certainly abstain. Despite coming out of the left (What little worthwhile aspect of it we have in this country) there is no reality in which I would ever support Biden and his handlers. The only question would be whether my rage and revulsion towards them would be enough to blackpill me into casting a vote for Trump. It's tempting, but even under those circumstances I don't think I could support a charlatan and self-serving grifter who probably answers to many of the same masters anyhow.
98% of rfks platform and message is deeply resonant with me and an embodiment of so much of what I think we need to get out of the many traps we are ensnared in, from the military industrial complex to the the burgeoning censorship industrial complex to his understanding of the profound effect of currency, debasement and the glimmer of hope that is Bitcoin, and so on and so forth. The problem in my view is that all of the merit of that is based on him truly being an independent actor that is not controlled by any of the interests that clearly pull Biden's strings and likely many of Trump's as well. I found his treatment of the genocide in Gaza as a guest on the Hill in the fall And in a few other venues to be a frankly appalling departure from his extremely measured intelligence and reason when speaking about Ukraine or any other disgusting American intervention. The contrast was sharp enough as to give me real pause and wonder what his relationship is to AIPAC and other deep pocketed interests thoroughly aligned with Israel. In my view, if he's not independent from those interests, he's not the independent candidate I want him to be. If he's so beholden to someone that he can't speak out against a literal genocide then I don't know how to value his noble and quite beautiful rejection of other American military fascinations. I did listen to his recent podcast episode intended to facilitate peacemaking dialogue between a Palestinian and a Israeli scholar hoping to find some clarity on this question, But while I did find his own description of his journey towards forgiveness of Sirhan Sirhan quite moving and powerful. I still found a disturbing bent towards the idea of Israel as a shining light in the darkness and a sort of default stance towards The Palestinians as the aggressors who need in some way to be brought to heel. I find nothing in my analysis of the last 75 years or of the current ghastly state of affairs to suggest that this is the case and I'm simply too confident of RFK's deep intellect to think that he would believe that he would entertain such a simplistic analysis. Leaving me to wonder what the genesis is of a viewpoint that seems so contradictory from the rest of his platform.
I'm still hopeful that I'll be able to find clarity on this and that it will resolve things sufficiently that I can get behind rfk's candidacy completely.
I think what I would like to know, at a basic level, is has the RFK campaign taken donations or other types of support at any point from AIPAC or other Israeli lobby groups.
I listened to the second installment of "A Path to Peace" and found it extremely disappointing and disheartening. In what is supposed to be a dialogue about how to reach peace between Israel and Palestine RFK chose a very hawkish zionist ex-mossad officer, which is fine. But to represent the Palestinian voice he chose a British-Palestinian moderate who clearly didn't even understand the issues very well whose entire analysis was that Palestinians should just give Israeli's whatever they want and that Palestinians don't have nearly any good reason to even be aggrieved. This essentially created a dynamic in which RFK hosted a debate about how to create peace between Isreal and Palestine with two pro-Israel voices who just agreed on everything and who and gave the actual Palestinian side of things no voice at all. This was somewhat similar to what I experienced in listening to the first episode, but much worse.
I know you didn't ask me for my opinion on this, but i certainly would be curious to hear yours. And i'd still like very much to hear what Eisenstein had to say.
Dear Zeya,
I am preparing to discuss the elephant in the room. There are other important stories that Gaza provides a distraction from which I reported in my latest post. That said, I did not see these Path to Peace episodes and wonder if you could please provide links in the comments here, and many thanks for posting. You are always welcome. Leland
Hi Leland. I appreciate your response!
What I was referring to was two episodes of the RFK podcast produced as part of a series 'The Path to Peace'. The first part aired in March and featured a dialogue between two Israeli and Palestinian scholars and facilitated by RFK. The scholars in question were actually friends and the tenor of the episode was very civil and thoughtful. I found RFK's description of his own path to forgiveness with Sirhan Sirhan in the intro incredibly moving. That said, the usefulness of the conversation seemed very limited by RFK's clear bias towards Israel and that the Palestinian scholar in the episode was clearly on the extremely moderate and pro-concessions side of the spectrum to an extent that there was very little conversation either about the horrors of what's happening in Gaza and even in the West Bank or about any real legitimacy to the Palestinian experience of being extremely aggrieved and persecuted. You can find it anywhere where his podcast airs but theres a link here:
https://rumble.com/v4gt1su-robert-f.-kennedy-jr-path-to-peace-episode-one.html
While I was just moderately discouraged by the first installment the one that just aired went much further down a road that left an awful taste in my mouth. I had hoped that the amount of devastation that has unfolded since March would have moved RFK in a direction of greater sympathy for the Palestinian plight and that this new episode would reflect that. Instead, it was essentially a conversation between a hard line zionist propagandist and a British-Palestinian writer who seemed only unsuitable for the project by virtue of being inarticulate and not seemingly a very deep thinker, but also someone totally divorced from the Palestinian experience by virtue of being a diaspora Palestinian with very little analysis or sympathy himself for the Palestinian desire for freedom, sovereignty, or even just not being butchered. I have to confess I was not able to finish the episode as it felt like an entirely unproductive Pro-Israel echo chamber.
https://open.spotify.com/episode/1K3hQdQb8pcoDFaSJxYJrH
As I have expressed, I have such a strange sense of cognitive dissonance between my perception of RFK as being morally courageous, deeply humane, and impressively intelligent on just about every topic...and then my perception of him as being none of those things in relation to what certainly feels like one of the most important topics of our time given the ongoing genocide.
So, yes, I would be extremely glad for RFK or any campaign spokespeople etc addressing this elephant the in room in any capacity they can.
Kind regards, z